As many of you may or may not know as a matter of personal intrigue and interest, I often frequent message boards and debate issues concerning Islam and Muslims in general. In fact, this very blog resulted from a need to want to catologue my various thoughts that often get lost on message boards.
Over the years, I have become more and more skeptical of those who even bring up the topic of Islam being a violent religion as I have come to realize several things about those who actually believe that statement:
1. They are open hypocrites
2. Are ignorant willfully or otherwise
3. Often xenophobic/racist in some form or another
The multitude of websites like jihadwatch, prophetofdoom, answeringislam, etc. or the associated authors, speakers, etc. like Wafa Sultan, Walid Shoebat, and others all prey on the masses who ask the question preying on either their ignorance about Muslims or their need to fuel their hatred of Muslims.
They all have in common the fact that they make very good money doing what they do. Islam/Muslim bashing is not only profitable, but you get to be on TV as well!
The problem with us a Muslims at times is we don’t know how to respond to such “critics” primarily because we don’t first consider the folly of these people for what it is. If we look at the reality that this group and their supporters are actually hypocrites and comical in their own rights, we could easiliy respond without emotion and debunk their every assertion without even trying.
Think of it as the difference between the Jedi and Sith methods of using the force. Now a critical analysis of both methods yeilds that neither are 100% right, but the Sith often fail because they become consumed in their passion, the Jedi prevail because of their indifference. This analogy applies to Muslims well if we are Star Wars fans in the first place 🙂
As Muslims we tend to react out of our passions and give these people the exact fuel they need to continue their money making schemes and need to feel superior over the inferior others.
The truth is if we breath and look at what they all do and the tactics they all have in common, we could easily prove their folly.
All critics of Islam/Muslims have one argumentive tactic in common, highlight the minority sensational stuff and make it seem like the majority.
As it applies to Muslims, to prove that Islam is a violent religion they merely say look at the actions of Muslim terrorists or the statements, protests, actions of individual Muslims.
As it applies to Islam, to prove that Islam is a violent religion they merely highlight some verses or ahadith to prove their point, it should be noted here that the majority of the verses come from one Surah/chapter of the Qur’an surah 9 with a sprinkling throughout other places in the Qur’an. The key point is that it’s about a list of 20-30 verses and hadith combined that all recite over and over verbatim.
These two points/concepts once we realize them for what they actually are, prove how false these accusers are and how their very tactics actually expose how they are hypocrites.
Muslims tend to make two general mistakes in handling this problem/debate:
1. We play the “pot calling the kettle black” game.
Basically, when they point out what some Muslims do for their proof, we instantly point out what some Christian, Jews, Hindu’s, etc. do. I have even played that game, but more as satire than anything else. This actually proves nothing, because we have to remember that their arguments are illogical from the onset and our attempt at logic by example will easily fail. Think of these people as conspiracy theorists. Most conspiracy theorists never accept blatant fact. They always have a counter argument and when they don’t, they just claim your part of the conspiracy, because conspiracy theorists already believe they have all the answers.
2. We play the “context” game.
Muslims, remember these guys are open hypocrites! They don’t believe in the Qur’an, don’t care to read it or understand it. They are not quoting the Qur’an for theological purposes most get their information from skilled people who know how to sound “legit” enough to pass off as already having done the work for them. That is why they rely heavily on these websites and speakers many who bill themselves as “former Muslims” because obviously this dozen of “former” Muslims know way more than a billion of daily practicing Muslims. 🙂 Therefore, we need to focus less and less on quoting the Qur’an or making contextual arguments in response to actual verses quoting in error.
So what approach should we take? Well it’s the very logical one when you think about it. When one commits a logical fallacy in a debate either on purpose or by accident, you don’t respond with a logical fallacy of your own, you merely point out the fallacy and let it fail on it’s own accord. That means you let them commit their fallacy and face it head on. If they claim that Islam is a violent religion because of 9/11, you don’t respond what Christians did during the crusades you show them how stupid that argument is, by pointing out what other Muslims did on 9/11 and the days following, in others words neutralize the argument, keep it focused on Muslims.
The reason why I say keep it focused on Muslims is I look at it as a declaration of my faith in Islam. If we believe Islam is the truth and our points are valid, then we don’t need to validate our beliefs or positions using anything other than Islam/Muslims. I believe our religion has o stand on it’s own merit if we are to strengthen our position and while I may not clearly articulate all that I mean I hope that this post in general, covers the main points as I go along….
Here’s how I debate the following arguments, with “a” meaning “accussation” and “r” meaning “response”. As a matter of method, I tend to respond to accusations based on the principle of the argument, not necessarily based on the actual words used as often its just meaningless diatribe and logical fallacies used to throw one of the central accusation’s path.
A. Islam is a violent religion because there are members of the Islamic religion who are violent and use verses from the Qur’an to support their actions.
This accusation has many forms, the most popular is just a cut and paste of verses from the Qur’an that “suggest” key word “suggest” violence, or some radical cleric making these claims. Pay close attention to the latter because often they never have clips of said clerics stating exactly which verses from the Qur’an they base their claims but merely just stating that their actions are in the Qur’an and shouting Allahu Akbar!
R. If that is so, than what about all the other Muslims who claim to be Muslims following the Qur’an who are not violent? Does an adherent of a religion automatically get to claim they are true followers because they say so?
These two questions open up a can of worms the accusers never expected because it hints to the core of the argument which is who actually speaks for Islam/Muslims and why? If the premise of their argument is that we know Islam is violent because of the actions of groups like Al-Qaeda, yet they and others represent 1% of the total world-wide populace. If such a statement can become conclusive evidence based on a sampling of 1% of a billion people, then what conclusions could we arrive at based on actions of the 99% ?
When this acusation is introduced it automatically proves that they have not considered the folly of the acussation because their very argument shows them to be in the weaker position. What they are basically stating is that to them it makes more sense to rely on the actions and beliefs of 1% of the population verses 99% of the population. Which is a very illogical way to base a conclusion. What’s even worse for them is when you ask them if they are willing to accept that theory as a matter of truth that can be applied to any group. If they are willing to do so, they are more foolish than you thought and you should leave them alone! The fact is they will never use the same standard across the board, remember this isn’t about them, it’s about us “others”. 🙂
A. Islam is a violent religion because there are “X” violent verses in the Qur’an and Hadith.
R. How many verses are there in the Qur’an? How many Hadith are there? What makes a verse violent?
Once again it’s a numbers game. These three questions almost kill the acusation. If we can decide about the character of a religion based on a particular sum of verses, then what’s that magic number? If x amount of verses are violent then y religion equals violence? Who gets to decide what verses to categorize and/or demostrate that they are violent?
This is why I believe it’s an ugly game from ugly people. If an accusation is logical it should be applied across the board and have simlar results.
What we ultimately have to remember is that when you engage these people in debate facts mean nothing. Like conspiracy theorists, the more facts you produce the more you are accused of being part of the conspiracy. That is why you have to get to the root of the acusation and get them to stand by their conclusions as it should be applicable across the board.
However the reality is that many of these people love to shift the goal posts when it relates to Islam/Muslims and not themselves.
In these two examples I presented with their core two accusations its easy to see why their accusations on there mere assertations are illogical because if applied toward the very accuser the accuser would be quiet.
Case in point, let’s say that their acusations were in fact logical. That would mean:
1. That any religion, group, etc. can be easily categorized and their “nature” accurately determined based on the actions of 1% of their population.
2. That all religions can be summed up based on a casual reading of 20 or so verses.
I could go on and on with this topic but I think you get the gist. Below is an extract of comments on a debate thread from a message board I started titled “Islam IS NOT a violent religion” the first extract is my initial post, the second two are examples of accusers posts, and the last a summary post that inspired my blog posting today. Enjoy! 🙂
Islam IS NOT a violent religion
1: The word Islam means “submission to God’s will” and “Peace” it’s best translated as “The Submission to God’s Will is true Peace”
2: The Qur’an is full of mandates that regulate the behaviors of men an women on the simple truths of maintaining the mizan “balance” by doing good works, being truthful, and just.
3: The Qur’an only ever allows fighting as a means to maintain justice and/or in defense with the superseding rules that peace is the ultimate alternative that one should always strive for.
4: Islam is the only major world religion that accepts other religions principle beliefs, core texts, and prophets as true.
5: Islam is one of the only major world religion that accepts that non-Muslims can be blessed and enter paradise.
6: Islam is the second largest religion in the world and since the beginning it’s primary method of growth was through word of mouth, The Qur’an is the only major religious text that explicitly tells it’s followers to never try to compel others to believe as they do.
7: The Qur’an is the only major religious text in which the vast majority deals primarily with devotion to God by treating people kindly, helping the orphans, poor, being honest, and being a good example.
8: The Qur’an is the only major religious text that explicitly considers all mankind regardless of race, sex, etc. as equals in the site of God.
examples of responses…
The Qur’an Says that People of Other Religions
are to be Violently Punished in This World
Allah himself fights against the unbelievers (9:30), so why should Muslims not fight in his cause rather than in the cause of evil (4:76)?
Against them make ready your strength to the utmost of your power, including steeds of war, to strike terror into (the hearts of) the enemies of Allah and your enemies and others besides, whom ye may not know (8:60)
Strive hard (Jihad) against the Unbelievers and the Hypocrites, and be firm against them. Their abode is Hell,- an evil refuge indeed.
(66:9, See also 9:73)
Muslims are to expect a reward in this life as well as the next (4:134), so it makes sense that unbelievers should be punished in this life as well:
…He whom Allah sendeth astray, for him there is no guide. For them is a penalty in the life of this world, but harder, truly, is the penalty of the Hereafter… (13:33:34)
All beings on heaven and earth will be forced to bow down to Allah, either willingly or by force:
And unto Allah falleth prostrate whosoever is in the heavens and the earth, willingly or unwillingly (13:15)
Those who resist Islam will be humiliated:
Those who resist Allah and His Messenger will be among those most humiliated. (58:20 – The context for this verse is the eviction of the Jewish tribes of Medina and the confiscation of their wealth, land, and children by Muhammad).
Non-Muslims are to be fought until religion is only for Allah:
And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is all for Allah… (8:39 – “Persecution” in this context means resistance to Islam – defined in the prior verse as an unwillingness to believe (see verse 38). This passage was “revealed” following a battle that Muhammad deliberately provoked. Verse 2:193 essentially says the same thing and was also “revealed” at a time when the Muslims were not under physical attack).
Non-Muslims are to be encroached on and pressured by the Muslims:
See they not that We gradually reduce the land (in their control) from its outlying borders? (13:41 – See also 21:44)
And He made you heirs to their land and their dwellings and their property, and (to) a land which you have not yet trodden, and Allah has power over all things. (33:27, See also Bukhari 53:392)
Allah will grant Muslims authority and power over all other people:
Allah has promised, to those among you who believe and work righteous deeds, that He will, of a surety, grant them in the land, inheritance (of power), as He granted it to those before them; that He will establish in authority their religion… (24:55)
(Muhammad’s companions continued to self-fulfill this prophecy with an aggressive and senseless military expansion that left a trail of bodies from Spain to India).
Allah provides instructions to Muslims for dealing with unbelievers who are unwilling to accept Islamic rule:
Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): “I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them.” This because they contended against Allah and His Messenger: If any contend against Allah and His Messenger, Allah is strict in punishment. (8:12-13)
The pattern of violence and aggressive disregard for human suffering that is persistent in Muslim history and contemporary attitude toward non-believers reflects the message of the Qur’an, which is one of personal superiority and arrogance.
In our modern world, Muslim dominance is characterized by the oppression and discrimination of non-Muslims, while Muslim minorities within larger societies are distinguished by varying degrees of petulant demand, discord and armed rebellion. Few Muslims are uncomfortable with this blatant double standard, in which Islam either plays the victim or unapologetically victimizes others, depending on its position of power – and the reason is obvious.
Islam is a supremacist ideology in which the role of non-believers is subordinate to the position of Muslims. Those who resist Islamic rule are to be fought until they are fully humiliated and forced to acknowledge their inferior status either by converting to Islam or by paying a poll-tax and otherwise accepting the subjugation of their own beliefs.
There is simply no other religion on earth that draws such sharp distinction between its own members and others, or spends as much time condemning and dehumanizing those who merely choose not to follow its dogma.
So much about Islamic terrorism and the general indifference of the broader Muslim community toward the violence makes sense only against this dual nature of Islam. Yes, the apologists are correct in saying that Islam teaches love and kindness, but they fail to add that this applies only to the treatment of those within the Muslim community. Loyalty to one’s own identity group is valued above all else and empathy for those outside the faith is optional at best – and even explicitly discouraged in places.
If this is a “misunderstanding” of Islam by modern-day “radicals,” then it is an error that the founder of Islam made as well. In Muhammad’s time, non-Muslims were put to death merely for speaking out against the new religion and its self-proclaimed prophet. Likewise, the Jews of Qurayza were summarily rounded-up and executed on Muhammad’s order, even though they had not even fought in battle. Since the life of a non-Muslim is cheap, actual physical harm to a Muslim is not necessary to justify murder according to the example of Muhammad.
The Qur’an meets every criterion by which we define hate speech. Not only does the message inspire loathing and disregard for others, but the text mandates the superiority of Islam, even if the means of establishment are by force.
In his later years, Muhammad directed military campaigns to subjugate other tribes and religions, “inviting” them to Islam at the point of a sword and forcing them to pay tribute nonetheless. He set in motion the aggressive military campaigns that made war against all five major world religions in just the first few decades following his death.
Islam incorporates the ultimate devaluation of non-Muslims in the most obvious way by teaching that while a Muslim may be punished with death for murdering a fellow Muslim (Bukhari 83:17), no Muslim can be put to death for killing a non-Muslim (Bukhari 83:50). The Qur’an’s “Law of Equality,” which assigns human value and rights based on gender, religion and status, is the polar opposite of equality in the sense intended by Western liberal tradition, which ideally respects no such distinction.
One can always find apologists willing to dismiss the harsh rhetoric of the Qur’an with creative interpretation, tortuous explanation or outright denial, but their words and deeds almost always belie a concern for Islam’s image that does not extend to Islam’s victims – at least not with the same sense of urgency – thus proving the point.
Of course, there are also exceptional Muslims who do not agree with Islamic supremacy and sincerely champion secularism and respect for all people. Some even find verses or fragments of such to support their independent beliefs. But, for these people, the Qur’an as a whole will always be a constant challenge, since it explicitly teaches the distinct and inferior status of non-Muslims.
List of Terrorist Attacks
This list, of over 12,000 terrorist attacks committed by Muslims since 9/11/01 (a rate of about three or four a day), is incomplete because only a small percentage of attacks were picked up by international news sources, even those resulting in multiple loss of life.
These are not incidents involving nominal Muslims killing for money or personal pride. We include attacks that can reasonably be determined to have been committed by Muslims out of religious duty – as interpreted by the perpetrator.
We usually list only attacks that result in loss of life (with a handful of exceptions). In several cases, the victims are undercounted because deaths from trauma caused by the Islamists may occur in later days, despite the best efforts of medical personnel to keep the victims alive.
We usually don’t include incidents related to combat, such as in Iraq and Afghanistan, unless it involves particularly heinous terrorist tactics. Unprovoked sniper, drive-by or roadside bombing attacks on military personnel serving normal police duties are sometimes included depending on the circumstances.
Unfortunately, this list of Muslim terrorist attacks barely scratches the surface of atrocities committed in the name of Islam that occur world-wide each day. For that reason, we don’t tally up the dead and dismembered, except on a weekly and monthly basis.
As an example, most news articles on the violence in southern Thailand note that about 900 people were killed in 2005. We estimate that 150 of these deaths are of the Islamic militants themselves, which means they killed some 750 people that year. But TROP was only able to record the deaths of 314. We underreported more than half in a country with a decent news infrastructure. Imagine what we don’t catch in the Sudan, where the toll runs into the hundreds of thousands!
The ridiculous level of violence that Islam serves up to the world makes it impossible to compile a complete list.
Interestingly, people often respond to the list by disparaging other religions, as if pulling everyone down to the same level satisfies some sort of moral preconception about religion and culture in general. Since no other religion inspires the sort of terrorism that Islam produces, the critic invariably finds it necessary to change the rules of comparison for one side of the equation in order to contrive preferred results.
Typically, this will take the form of reaching far back into a religion’s history to find the worst that can be found, even if it is in a time of war or is in utter contradiction to the teachings of the faith. In a fit of self-congratulation, the critic then holds their straw man up against our list of attacks – which are bound to a particular timeframe and constrained by the rules of non-warfare and overt religious motivation – failing to realize the extent to which they have mitigated their own argument.
We hope that the more open-minded will be educated by this [non-religious, non-partisan] site, have a better understanding of the threat that the “Religion of Peace” poses across the globe, and be better able to put complaints of “Islamophobia” into perspective.
Who knows – perhaps one day Muslims will have a change of heart and decide to take the sort of action that one might expect of people who believe that it really is wrong to kill in the name of their religion. We’ll know when this happens because it will be when Islam exchanges petty complaint for true contrition, and roots out the extremist elements to end the violence – as opposed to offering occasional lip service that is designed merely to appeal to Western tastes.
>>>List of Terrorist Attacks in the last two months<<<
Date Country City Killed Injured Description
2009.02.28 Iraq Baghdad 2 7 Jihadis murder two Iraqis in a restaurant bombing.
2009.02.27 Iraq Hawija 2 2 Two Iraqis are taken down by al-Qaeda gunmen.
2009.02.27 Somalia Mogadishu 42 125 Forty-two civilians are killed in three days of Islamic militia violence.
2009.02.27 Pakistan Hangu 4 5 Mujahideen open fire on a school van, killing three students and their driver.
2009.02.26 Pakistan Razmak 1 0 The Taliban behead a 35-year-old Afghan civilian as a ‘gift’ to the new American President.
2009.02.26 Iraq Baghdad 2 10 Two Iraqis are killed when Islamists explode a bomb near a university.
2009.02.26 Pakistan Mohmand 2 0 Islamic militants kill two tribesmen and blow up a girl’s school.
2009.02.25 Afghanistan Kandahar 2 8 Two civilians are killed in a Taliban bombing along a city street.
2009.02.25 Ingushetia Karabulak 1 0 Fundamentalists gun down the owner of a local bowling alley.
2009.02.25 Thailand Narathiwat 3 0 Three people are beheaded by Muslim radicals.
2009.02.25 Somalia Mogadishu 2 4 Two schoolchildren under the age of ten are taken out by an Islamic mortar shell on a school.
2009.02.24 Somalia Mogadishu 18 78 Eighteen people, including woman and children, are killed when Islamic hardliners attack peacekeepers.
2009.02.24 Afghanistan Helmand 5 0 Religious extremists kill four US soldiers and a civilian with a roadside bomb.
2009.02.24 Pakistan Landikotal 2 0 Two women who may have been prostitutes are tortured to death after having their faces disfigured.
2009.02.24 Pakistan Quetta 4 0 A Shia trader and his three sons are brutally shot to death by Sunni extremists while on their way home.
2009.02.24 Thailand Yala 1 0 A 41-year-old woman is shot to death by Islamic terrorists.
2009.02.24 Pakistan Kohat 2 0 Two civilians on a motorcycle are taken out by Sunni bombers.
2009.02.24 Thailand Yala 1 3 Muslim militants storm a food shop and murder the owner.
2009.02.23 Iraq Baghdad 5 15 Jihadis take down five Iraqis in two terror attacks.
2009.02.23 Thailand Narathiwat 1 1 A rubber tapper is brutally shot to death by Muslim radicals, who also shoot his wife.
2009.02.23 Pakistan Bannu 1 2 A policeman is murdered by a Shahid suicide bomber.
2009.02.23 Sudan Darfur 2 4 Two Doctors without Borders humanitarian workers are shot to death by suspected Janjaweed militia.
2009.02.22 Somalia Mogadishu 11 15 al-Shabaab suicide bombers take out eleven Burundi peacekeepers on their base.
2009.02.22 Algeria Spas 9 3 Islamic fundamentalists machine-gun nine local guards to death in an ambush.
2009.02.22 Afghanistan Zaranj 1 3 A local guard is taken down by suicide bombers.
2009.02.22 Thailand Yala 2 0 A married couple are beheaded by Muslim militants on their way home from work at a rubber plantation.
2009.02.22 Egypt Cairo 1 21 Islamists bomb a market, killing a 17-year-old French girl.
2009.02.22 Pakistan Karachi 1 0 A man chops his 60-year-old sister into pieces on suspicion that she was having unmarried sex.
2009.02.21 Iraq Tikrit 2 0 Two policemen are killed in separate Jihad attacks.
2009.02.21 Afghanistan Torkham 1 2 A passerby is blown up when Sunni bombers target an oil tanker.
2009.02.21 Nigeria Bauchi 11 38 A Muslim mob goes on a rampage, burning churches and killing Christians.
2009.02.21 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 4 0 Suicide bombers murder four more innocents.
2009.02.21 Pakistan Multan 2 0 Two adults are beheaded when it is discovered that they are having ‘illegitimate’ sex.
2009.02.21 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 2 5 Sunnis open fire on a Shia funeral procession, killing at least two mourners.
2009.02.21 Iraq Baaj 5 0 Five Iraqi security personnel are murdered when Islamists booby-trap a building.
2009.02.20 Pakistan Karachi 1 2 A boy is gunned down in a sectarian dispute.
2009.02.20 Iraq Mosul 2 0 Jihadis kill a man and his son in a roadside bombing.
2009.02.20 Thailand Yala 2 0 Two soldiers guarding teachers are shot and beheaded by Religion of Peace radicals.
2009.02.20 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 32 145 A suicidal Sunni detonates at a Shia funeral, massacring thirty-two mourners.
2009.02.20 Somalia Mogadishu 1 2 A civilian is killed in a terror attack by Islamic hardliners.
2009.02.19 Afghanistan Khost 1 0 A member of a road construction crew is taken out by Islamic bombers.
2009.02.19 Afghanistan Khost 3 0 Three local guards are murdered by Sunni extremists.
2009.02.19 Iraq Mosul 1 7 A suicide bomber takes out an Iraqi policeman.
2009.02.19 Iraq Mosul 1 0 A Christian businessman is gunned down in his shop.
2009.02.19 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 1 0 A local Shia leader is shot to death by Sunni militants.
2009.02.19 Pakistan Mohmand 1 0 Religious extremists assassinate a tribal elder.
2009.02.18 Jordan Petra 1 0 A 19-year-old man shoots his divorced sister to death over ‘immoral’ behavior.
2009.02.18 Pakistan Swat 1 0 Muslim radicals shoot a journalist thirty-two times following a peace rally.
2009.02.18 Pakistan Quetta 1 0 A local Sunni leader is gunned down by Shia militants.
2009.02.17 Iraq Baqubah 2 10 Jihadi bombers manage to take out two Iraqi civilians.
2009.02.17 Pakistan Peshawar 4 16 Four people are murdered in a Mujahideen car bombing in a residential neighborhood.
2009.02.17 Pakistan Khar 4 4 A woman is among four civilians killed when the Taliban rocket homes and a school.
2009.02.17 Iraq Mosul 1 1 A Christian is gunned down by suspected Islamists.
2009.02.16 Pakistan Karamkot 1 0 A 35-year-old civilian is kidnapped and killed in captivity by Islamic extremists.
2009.02.16 Iraq Baghdad 8 24 Eight Shia pilgrims are blown apart by Sunni bombers in two attacks.
2009.02.15 Algeria Tebessa 5 4 Religious radicals detonate a bomb under a passing truck, killing five occupants.
2009.02.15 Algeria Boumerdes 3 0 Three off-duty soldiers are stopped a roadblock and machine-gunned to death by fundamentalists.
2009.02.15 Iraq al-Taji 10 0 Ten victims of al-Qaeda militia are found in a mass grave.
2009.02.14 Afghanistan Khost 1 2 Sunni radicals assassinate a local governor.
2009.02.14 Iraq Baghdad 40 0 Forty Shiite abductees are found in a mass grave in a Sunni stronghold.
2009.02.14 Lebanon Beirut 1 0 A minority Druse is stabbed to death by Hezbollah supporters at a memorial rally.
2009.02.13 Iraq Baghdad 2 0 A man and his son are murdered in their home by Sunni gunmen.
2009.02.13 Afghanistan Kohat 2 0 The Taliban shoot dead two women for ‘immoral’ behavior, then dump their burka-clad bodies in a ditch.
2009.02.13 Algeria Fum 7 0 An infant and two women are among seven people blown up by Islamic fundamentalists.
2009.02.13 Afghanistan Kandahar 4 0 Four Afghan policemen are killed by the Taliban in a roadside bombing.
2009.02.13 Pakistan Peshawar 2 3 Two more policemen are killed by religious extremists in separate attacks.
2009.02.13 Iraq Karbala 39 60 A female suicide bomber detonates in a tent full of Shia pilgrims, sending nearly forty souls to Allah.
2009.02.12 USA Buffalo, NY 1 0 The founder of a Muslim TV station beheads his wife in the hallway for seeking a divorce.
2009.02.12 Pakistan North Waziristan 1 1 Taliban militants murder a police officer in an unprovoked rocket attack. A second policeman is killed elsewhere.
2009.02.12 Ingushetia Nazran 4 2 Four Russians are killed when Islamic militants detonate a bomb during a raid.
2009.02.12 Iraq Mosul 4 5 Jihadis take out four local cops with a roadside bomb.
2009.02.12 Somalia Mogadishu 2 6 Two laborers die from shrapnel injuries when Mujahideen mortar a seaport.
2009.02.12 Afghanistan Paktika 1 5 A suicide bomber murders a police officer who stops to help him.
2009.02.12 Thailand Pattani 3 1 Islamic bombers kill three policemen guarding teachers from attacks.
2009.02.11 Iraq Baghdad 2 18 Two Shia pilgrims are murdered by Sunni bombers in separate attacks.
2009.02.11 Afghanistan Logar 4 0 Four local soldiers are killed in a Taliban roadside bombing on their vehicle.
2009.02.11 Afghanistan Kabul 28 57 Suicidal Sunnis attack two government buildings, randomly shooting nearly thirty office workers to death.
2009.02.11 Thailand Pattani 2 0 Religion of Peace terrorists shoot two men to death as they are standing in front of a school.
2009.02.11 Jordan Amman 1 0 A 24-year-old woman is stabbed to death in bed by her brother, who suspects her of having an affair.
2009.02.11 Iraq Baghdad 16 44 Jihadis explode a pair of bombs at a bus station, slaughtering sixteen Iraqis.
2009.02.11 Thailand Pattani 1 0 A 40-year-old man is gunned down in a Muslim drive-by attack.
2009.02.11 Pakistan Peshawar 1 8 A local lawmaker is murdered by a bomb planted by suspected Islamists.
2009.02.10 Pakistan Hangu 17 30 Seventeen people are killed when Shia and Sunni rivals clash.
2009.02.10 Iraq Mosul 2 0 Sunni extremists gun down two policemen at a checkpoint.
2009.02.10 Thailand Pattani 2 1 Muslim extremists murder two people is separate drive-by attacks.
2009.02.09 Afghanistan Kabul 1 0 An Indian Christian, who worked for a food chain, is reported dead four months after being abducted by Sunni extremists.
2009.02.09 Pakistan North Waziristan 2 0 Holy Warriors shoot two civilians to death in separate attacks.
2009.02.09 Afghanistan Khogyani 2 3 Islamic extremists detonate a bomb near a police vehicle, killing two local cops.
2009.02.09 Afghanistan Nimroz 3 0 Three Afghans are taken out by a Fedayeen suicide bomber.
2009.02.09 Pakistan Baran Pul 5 17 A religious extremist detonates himself in a crowd, killing five other people.
2009.02.09 Iraq Mosul 5 3 Four US soldiers and a local interpreter are killed by a Shahid suicide bomber.
2009.02.09 Iraq Mosul 3 7 Mujahideen murder three Iraqis with a mortar strike.
2009.02.09 Pakistan Khyber Agency 10 10 Rival Islamist groups clash, leaving ten people dead.
2009.02.09 Pakistan Darra Adamkhel 13 38 Eleven children are among thirteen killed when Islamic militants shell a girl’s school.
2009.02.09 Thailand Narathiwat 1 0 A 26-year-old woman is shot to death by Islamic terrorists.
2009.02.08 Pakistan Lakorain 1 1 A truck driver is shot to death by Taliban while on the job.
2009.02.08 Afghanistan Kabul 1 0 The Taliban release a video showing the beheading of a kidnapped Polish engineer.
2009.02.08 Iraq Baghdad 2 12 Two Shia pilgrims are murdered by Sunni bombers while walking along the side of a road.
2009.02.08 Somalia Mogadishu 3 7 A child is among three people killed in two attacks following calls for holy war.
2009.02.08 Thailand Yala 1 0 Islamic rebels shoot a 29-year-old civilian in the head along the side of a road.
2009.02.08 Pakistan Swat 1 0 Jihadis kidnap and decapitate a civilian.
2009.02.08 Pakistan Swat 3 0 Mujahideen ambush and kill three local soldiers.
2009.02.07 Afghanistan Nangarhar 2 1 Two people are killed in two attacks by Islamic terrorists.
2009.02.07 Thailand Narathiwat 1 0 Mujahideen gun down a 48-year-old rubber plantation worker.
2009.02.07 Pakistan Punjab 7 0 Seven local cops are murdered by Islamist attackers.
2009.02.06 Pakistan Kohat 1 2 Sunni radicals open fire on a passing bus, killing a passenger.
2009.02.06 Pakistan Miranshah 2 0 The Taliban abduct two civilians, kill them, then dump their bodies at a bus stop.
2009.02.06 Afghanistan Laghman 2 0 Taliban gunmen ambush and kill two local security men.
2009.02.05 Pakistan Orakzai 1 0 Islamists kidnap and murder the head of a teachers association.
2009.02.05 Iraq Khanaqin 16 12 A horrific suicide bombing at a restaurant leaves sixteeen Iraqi patrons dead.
2009.02.05 Pakistan Swat 3 3 Religious extremists barge into a home, kill three women and kidnap three survivors.
2009.02.05 Pakistan Punjab 32 48 A suicide bomber at a rival religious procession sends more than 30 innocent souls to Allah.
2009.02.04 Iraq Baqubah 8 0 Eight decapitated al-Qaeda victims are found in a mass grave.
2009.02.04 Afghanistan Helmand 6 0 A brutal Taliban roadside bombing leaves six Afghanis dead.
2009.02.04 Somalia Mogadishu 1 0 The head of a radio station is gunned down by suspected Islamists.
2009.02.04 Somalia Mogadishu 1 0 A journalist is assassinated by al-Shabaab gunmen.
2009.02.03 Algeria Ait Chaafa 1 9 Fundamentalists kill a security officer with a bombing attack.
2009.02.03 Pakistan Swat 3 5 Islamic militants assault a police post, killing three local officers.
2009.02.03 Pakistan Orakzai 1 0 Fundamentalists behead a local civilian.
2009.02.03 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 1 18 One person is killed when an Islamic radical tosses a grenade into a rival mosque.
2009.02.03 Thailand Pattani 2 0 Two civilians are shot inside their homes by Mujahideen.
2009.02.03 Thailand Narathiwat 1 0 Islamic gunmen chase down a man with a pickup truck then shoot him to death.
2009.02.02 Pakistan Punjab 1 0 A local leader is gunned down is a sectarian incident.
2009.02.02 Afghanistan Uruzgan 21 8 A Fedayeen suicide bomber murders over twenty local police trainees at their facility.
2009.02.02 Pakistan Quetta 1 0 A Shia businessman is shot to death by Sunni extremists.
2009.02.02 Thailand Pattani 2 0 Two security personnel are beheaded by Muslim militants, who also burn the bodies.
2009.02.02 Pakistan Swat 8 0 Eight people are shot to death by Taliban militants in various attacks.
2009.02.02 Iraq Mosul 3 9 Three Iraqis are murdered by Mujahideen roadside bombers.
2009.02.01 Philippines Siocon 4 1 Moro Islamists capture four gold prospectors, hog-tie them and then hack them to death with machetes.
2009.02.01 Dagestan Makhachkala 4 0 Suspected Islamists open fire on a cafe, killing four patrons.
2009.02.01 Pakistan Shajwal Chak 1 0 A Christian man begging for wages owed is murdered by Muslim employers as they deride his faith.
2009.01.31 Pakistan Swat 3 1 Taliban militants ambush and kill three local security personnel.
2009.01.30 Iraq Baiji 1 1 Sunni terrorists open fire on a polling station, killing an American guard.
2009.01.29 Pakistan Tal 1 4 Religious extremists slit the throat of a policeman.
2009.01.29 Pakistan Miranshah 1 0 Sunni radicals kidnap and shoot a 30-year-old local man.
2009.01.28 Pakistan Mingora 8 0 Eight bullet-ridden victims of Taliban justice are found.
2009.01.28 Iraq Kirkuk 2 0 Sunni extremists attack a polling station, killing two guards.
2009.01.27 Israel Kissufim 1 2 Palestinian bombers murder an Israelis border guard.
2009.01.27 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 1 0 A second Shia civilian is gunned down in as many days by sectarian extremists.
2009.01.27 Iraq Mosul 3 3 Three Iraqis are killed in a car bomb attack on Kurds by suspected Sunnis terrorists.
2009.01.27 Afghanistan Kandahar 4 10 Taliban bombers blow up a minibus killing four civilians.
2009.01.27 Thailand Pattani 2 0 A Buddhist married couple is brutally murdered by Muslim gunmen in a drive-by attack.
2009.01.26 Pakistan North Waziristan 1 0 Religious militants kidnap a man, chop off his hand and then execute him.
2009.01.26 Somalia Baidoa 4 10 Four people are killed when al-Shabaab terrorists hurl a grenade into a bus stop.
2009.01.26 Pakistan Quetta 1 0 A Shia leader is assassinated by Sunni gunmen.
2009.01.26 Thailand Narathiwat 1 1 Islamists gun down a 26-year-old civilian.
2009.01.26 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 6 22 Sunni radicals detonate a bicycle bomb in a public area, killing six civilians.
2009.01.26 Pakistan Lahore 1 0 A 45-year-old woman is stabbed to death by her son on suspicion of an illicit relationship.
2009.01.25 Thailand Narathiwat 1 1 A factory worker is shot to death by Mujahideen while driving with his wife.
2009.01.25 Iran Saravan 12 0 A dozen policemen are killed by a Sunni terror group, ‘Soldiers of Allah.’
2009.01.24 Israel Ashkelon 1 0 A young Arab mother is stabbed to death over suspected immorality
2009.01.24 Somalia Mogadishu 15 24 Fifteen bus passengers on a public bus are blown to bits by a Shahid suicide bomber.
2009.01.24 Thailand Yala 4 0 Four construction workers are murdered by Islamist gunmen at a building site.
2009.01.24 Iraq Fallujah 5 14 Five Iraqis are taken out in a vicious Fedayeen truck bombing.
2009.01.24 Pakistan Bannu 1 0 Suspected Islamists kidnap and murder a local civilian.
2009.01.24 Pal. Auth. Gaza 1 0 Hamas executes a 46-year-old human rights activist.
2009.01.24 Pakistan Khairabad 1 0 A night cleaner at a police station is killed by a Sunni rocket.
2009.01.23 Thailand Yala 3 0 A 65-year-old woman is among three civilians gunned down in separate Mujahideen drive-by attacks.
2009.01.23 Pakistan Swat 2 0 Fundamentalists stab a man to death over his ‘un-Islamic’ style of dress, then travel to his house where they murder his father.
2009.01.23 Iraq Baghdad 8 0 Five women and a 12-year-old girl are among eight Sunni family members murdered in their home by sectarian rivals.
2009.01.23 Iraq Baghdad 1 1 A 7-year-old boy is killed, and his mother injured, by a hidden bomb.
2009.01.23 Pakistan Mingora 3 1 A woman is among three civilians murdered in a Jihad roadside attack.
2009.01.23 Pakistan Mingora 2 22 A Fedayeen suicide bomber kills two local soldiers.
2009.01.23 Afghanistan Kabul 6 0 Six people, including an Indian husband and wife are shot dead when the Taliban fire into a home.
2009.01.22 Thailand Pattani 1 0 A shopowner is murdered in his store by Mujahideen gunmen.
2009.01.22 Iraq Kut 4 0 Parents and their two children are wiped out inside their home by Jihadi gunmen.
2009.01.22 Pakistan Derpakhel 1 0 A civilivan is kidnapped and brutally murdered by Sunni radicals.
2009.01.22 Pakistan Swat 5 8 Two people beheaded are among five civilians taken out by Mujahideen in three attacks.
2009.01.22 Jordan Amman 1 0 A man kills his 19-year-old divorced sister for “having a bad reputation.”
2009.01.21 Jordan Amman 1 0 A 17-year-old stomps and stabs his 13-year-old sister to death in an honor killing.
2009.01.21 Afghanistan Heart 2 1 Two local soldiers are killed by a suicide bomber.
2009.01.21 Iraq Khalis 18 0 Eighteen al-Qaeda victims are found in a mass grave.
2009.01.21 Iraq Baghdad 4 8 Islamic bombers take out four students near a university.
2009.01.21 Afghanistan Baghlan 0 5 A suicide bomber injures five children at a wedding.
2009.01.21 Thailand Pattani 1 0 An older man walking home with his cattle is shot to death by Muslim militants.
2009.01.20 Afghanistan Kandahar 2 3 Religious extremists murder two Afghans with a bicycle bomb.
2009.01.20 Pakistan Sindh 1 0 A 55-year-old member of the Ahmadiyya is killed merely on account of his faith.
2009.01.20 Iraq Mosul 2 1 A real estate agent brutally gunned down in his office is among two civilians murdered by the Mujahideen.
2009.01.20 Afghanistan Bala Mughab 3 7 Talibanis ambush a police post, killing three local officers and kidnapping seven others.
2009.01.20 Pakistan Miranshah 6 0 Six civilians are rounded up and shot to death by Islamic extremists.
2009.01.20 Iraq Baghdad 3 5 Three civilians are taken down by Jihadi bombers.
2009.01.19 Iraq Tikrit 2 0 Two young civilians are taken out in a roadside bombing.
2009.01.18 Pakistan Swat 4 2 Two brothers murdered in their home are among four people taken out by Mujahideen.
2009.01.17 Pakistan Miranshah 1 0 An Afghan civilian is murdered by the Taliban.
2009.01.17 Pakistan Matani 1 0 A faith healer is abducted and beheaded by Islamists.
2009.01.17 Algeria Miliana 1 0 A man has his throat slit by Islamic fundamentalists at a fake roadblock.
2009.01.17 Iraq Baghdad 1 1 Jihad bombers kill the driver of a municipal vehicle.
2009.01.17 Somalia Mogadishu 2 9 al-Shabab militants take out two civilians during an attack on African peacekeepers.
2009.01.17 Afghanistan Nangarhar 1 2 A civilian is taken down by a Fedayeen suicide bomber in a minivan.
2009.01.17 Iraq Mosul 2 0 Two innocent guards at a cell phone tower are gunned down by Sunni extremists.
2009.01.17 Afghanistan Kabul 4 23 A woman and child are among four civilians killed outside the German embassy when a Holy Warrior detonates beside them.
2009.01.16 Iraq Mosul 1 2 Mujahideen storm a home and murder a woman inside.
2009.01.16 Iraq Mosul 1 0 The local Christian owner of a car repair shop is brutally murdered by Islamic terrorists.
2009.01.15 Pakistan Miranshah 1 0 A 30-year-old civilian is abducted and murdered by Islamic radicals.
2009.01.15 Somalia Kismayo 1 0 Islamists assassinate a former statesman after ‘sentencing’ him to death.
2009.01.14 Iraq Mosul 2 4 A Holy Warrior takes out two Iraqis with a suicide belt.
2009.01.14 Somalia Mogadishu 6 18 A half-dozen civilians are killed due to an Islamist mortar attack on the presidential palace.
2009.01.14 Pakistan Quetta 4 0 Four Shia are ambushed and killed by Sunni militants with automatic weapons.
2009.01.13 Thailand Pattani 2 0 Two civilians are shot to death by Mujahideen.
2009.01.13 Thailand Pattani 2 0 Two village chiefs are shot to death in Muslim drive-by attacks.
2009.01.13 Pakistan Matta 3 4 A beheaded rickshaw driver is among three people killed in separate terror attacks.
2009.01.13 Pakistan Miranshah 1 0 A civilian is abducted and brutally beheaded by religious radicals.
2009.01.13 Thailand Narathiwat 1 4 A local soldier succumbs to shrapnal injuries following a Religion of Peace bombing attack.
2009.01.12 Somalia Mogadishu 13 30 At least thirteen people are killed in a brutal mortar attack by Islamic militia.
2009.01.12 Pakistan Hangu 5 21 Five more people are killed in sectarian violence between Sunni and Shia.
2009.01.12 Ingushetia Nazran 1 1 Islamic snipers pick off a local soldier.
2009.01.12 Iraq Baghdad 8 31 Eight Iraqis are burned or blasted to death in three Jihad bombings.
2009.01.12 Pakistan North Waziristan 2 0 Two brothers are abducted and brutally murdered by Mujahideen.
2009.01.11 Somalia Guriel 30 50 al-Shabaab hardline fundamentalists attack a rival group, leaving about thirty people dead.
2009.01.11 Pakistan Bajaur 0 4 Religious extremists abduct and then chop the ears off of four private security guards.
2009.01.11 Pakistan Swat 4 0 A father and son are among four civilians shot to death by Taliban militants in three attacks.
2009.01.11 Iraq Mosul 5 4 Five Iraqis are murdered by Islamic militants in two attacks.
2009.01.11 Pakistan Mohmand 6 7 Taliban militants overrun a military base, killing at least six local soldiers.
2009.01.11 Thailand Yala 3 2 Two Buddhists are among three farmers shot to death by Islamic terrorists.
2009.01.11 Algeria Merine 2 2 A mother and child are gunned down by armed Islamists at a fake roadblock.
2009.01.10 Pakistan Sibi 2 0 Two Shias are assassinated by Sunni terrorists.
2009.01.10 Thailand Pattani 1 0 A 54-year-old civilian is gunned down by Mujahideen.
2009.01.10 Pakistan Chak 0 1 Six Muslim men gang-rape a 14-year-old girl in front of her parents because they are Christian.
2009.01.10 Pakistan Hangu 47 60 A Muslim group attacks a rival funeral, setting off Sunni-Shia violence that leaves nearly fifty dead over the next four days.
2009.01.09 Israel Rehovot 0 1 A Muslim yells ‘Allah Akbar’ and strikes a Jewish teen with an axe.
2009.01.09 Afghanistan Nimroz 10 3 A Shahid blows himself up in a fruit shop, taking out ten patrons and employees.
2009.01.09 Somalia Gedo 1 5 Islamic militants assassinate a local mayor with a rocket.
2009.01.09 Iraq Baghdad 9 15 A child is among nine Iraqis taken out be Jihadi bomber in three attacks.
2009.01.09 Pakistan Swat 2 0 Two locals are abducted and butchered by Islamic militants.
2009.01.09 Pakistan Lahore 0 5 Fundamentalists bomb movie theaters accused of showing ‘anti-Islamic’ films.
2009.01.08 Afghanistan Kandahar 3 21 A Holy Warrior takes out three civilians with an explosives belt.
2009.01.08 Iraq Jalawla 6 7 Six Iraqis are blown up in a Jihad bomb attack.
2009.01.07 Somalia Yaqshid 4 2 Four local soldiers are killed when Islamists stop their vehilce with a roadside bomb, then toss a grenade at the survivors.
2009.01.07 Somalia Yubsan 1 0 A humanitarian worker and father of five is shot to death in cold blood by Islamic terrorists.
2009.01.07 Pakistan Swat 2 0 Two civilians are shot to death by terrorists in separate incidents.
2009.01.07 Pakistan North Waziristan 2 0 Two Afghan civilians are kidnapped and brutally executed by religious radicals.
2009.01.07 Pal. Auth. Gaza 6 0 Three brothers are among six people shot to death by Hamas militants.
2009.01.07 Pakistan Hungu 4 1 Four policemen die from burns and shrapnel during a Taliban rocket attack.
2009.01.06 Pakistan Mingora 6 0 Six local cops are kidnapped and brutally executed by Sunni radicals.
2009.01.06 Iraq Baghdad 4 6 Four Iraqis are taken out by roadside bombers.
2009.01.06 Iraq Mosul 2 6 A Shahid successfully kills two civilians with a suicide bomb.
2009.01.06 Thailand Pattani 1 0 An Islamic terror attack leaves a 47-year-old security man dead.
2009.01.05 Pakistan Swat 2 0 Two persons are murdered by Mujahideen in separate attacks, including a woman in her home.
2009.01.05 Afghanistan Kandahar 1 0 A pro-government mosque leader is taken out by Islamic gunmen
2009.01.05 Thailand Narathiwat 1 1 Religious radicals gun down a 51-year-old cop.
2009.01.05 Afghanistan Kandahar 3 1 Religious extremists attack a police post, killing three local officers.
2009.01.05 Thailand Narathiwat 1 1 Islamists shoot at a married couple with automatic weapons, killing the husband and injuring his wife.
2009.01.05 Pakistan Quetta 2 0 Two Shia civilians are shot to death by Sunni militants.
2009.01.05 Pakistan Bannu 3 0 Three family men are abducted and executed by the Taliban.
2009.01.05 Iraq Baghdad 3 6 Jihadis plant a bomb outside a soccer stadium, killing three Iraqis.
2009.01.05 Thailand Yala 1 2 A villager is shot to death by Mujahid while standing with his neighbors.
2009.01.04 Iraq Baghdad 36 72 Dozens of women and children are blown to bits by a Shahid suicide bomber targeting a crowd of Shiite pilgrims near a shrine.
2009.01.04 Thailand Pattani 1 1 Muslim gunmen murder a Buddhist man and injure his wife as they are riding in their vehicle.
2009.01.04 Pakistan Swat 2 0 Muslim fundamentalists abduct and brutally execute two police officers, beheading one and hanging his head from a pole.
2009.01.04 Pal. Auth. Gaza 35 75 The Islamic terror group, Hamas, ‘executes’ thirty-five rivals and maims over seventy others over the course of several days.
2009.01.04 Pakistan Di Khan 10 25 Islamic bombers blast at least ten people to death in an attack at a college campus.
2009.01.04 Pakistan Matta 3 0 Three persons are murdered by suspected Taliban gunmen.
2009.01.03 Iraq Baghdad 4 16 Shia pilgrims are among the victims of two Sunni bombing attacks.
2009.01.02 Pakistan Bajaur 1 0 Muslim terrorists shoot a tribal elder to death.
2009.01.02 Iraq al-Yusufiyah 23 110 A Fedayeen suicide bomber wades into a lunch crowd at a reconciliation meeting between Sunni and Shia leaders, killing twenty-three.
2009.01.02 Somalia Mogadishu 9 0 Two soldiers and seven civilians are killed in an Mujahid bombing and the ensuing fire fight.
2009.01.02 Pakistan Swat 3 0 Three civilians are shot to death in two attacks.
2009.01.02 Pakistan Balogram 2 0 Two policemen are abducted by Islamists and gruesomely tortured to death.
2009.01.02 Somalia Mogadishu 1 0 A local cleric is shot to death by al-Shabaab radicals in his home in front of his blind mother.
2009.01.02 Pakistan Mingora 1 0 A local dancing girl is quickly gunned down by Islamists after her husband kicks her out of the house.
2009.01.01 Somalia Mogadishu 2 0 Two local officials are assassinated by Mujahideen.
2009.01.01 Pakistan Swat 1 0 Militants drag a man out of his home and cut off his head in a public square.
2009.01.01 Pakistan Ghania 2 0 A young man chops his mother and daughter into pieces after they ignore his warning to end an illicit affair with a local man.
2009.01.01 Somalia Afgoye 1 0 A journalist is killed during an attack by Islamic militia.
2009.01.01 Pakistan Peshawar 3 6 Three policemen are killed by two Religion of Peace bombs.
2009.01.01 Pakistan Swat 3 0 Three people are shot to death by Islamic terrorists in separate attacks.
2009.01.01 Pakistan Bajaur 4 16 Four civilians are killed when Mujahideen fire rockets into an office complex.
2009.01.01 Iraq Mosul 3 5 A Shahid takes out three Iraqis.
2009.01.01 Somalia Baidoa 1 0 A member of a reconciliation committee is murdered by Islamic militia.
This is all they have people, varying degrees of the same tired argument!
My “summary” response….
I have never seen so many logical fallacies in one thread from members hell bent on “proving” that Islam is a violent religion.
My opening point was theological in nature. I merely pointed out that Islam is a religion and therefore as it should be expected of all religions, to argue the merits/claims of that religion the debate should be contained within the confines of what the religion in of itself states about itself.
However, what the “hell bent” crowd continue to use as their “proof” is not the actual theology, teachings, scholarly writings/interpretations of the religion, but the actions of individual Muslims and/or groups.
This is where the “hell bent” crowd become open hypocrites and why in defense people readily point to the actions Christians have committed over the course of time.
The “hell bent” hypothesis is pretty simple once you strip away all their cut and pastes from anti-Islam cites who wouldn’t last 30 minutes in a debate with intelligent people is thus:
Islam is a violent religion because their are members of the Islamic religion who are violent and use verses from the Qur’an to support their actions.
That’s the dumbest position in the world on the issue and why Christianity is almost always gone after in these types of debate, because the hypocrisy of the statement is just jaw-dropping, because the assertion by those foolish enough to make it suggests that somehow Islam is the only religion in recorded history that have had members who have committed violence using their religious texts as justification. The vanity in such assertions act as if Slavery, Colonization, Genocide, etc. were not committed by Christians using the same good book as the very Christians making the hypocritical statement against Muslims.
Which is why I never go down this fruitless path because it always ends up the same with the accusers often self-professed Christians just becoming more self-righteous and idiotic with each post. For instance, it was stated in this thread as it often is that in essence these violent Muslims are proof because they claim to be following the Qur’an!
That’s laughable for several reasons the hypocrites making the claim fail to think and realize:
1. If that is so, than what about all the other Muslims who claim to be Muslims following the Qur’an who are not violent? Who actually speaks for Muslims and Why and who gets to decide? Why is it so easy to believe the terrorists and not the billion Muslims who are not terrorists?
2. Does an adherent of a religion automatically get to claim they are true followers because they say so? If that is the case why isn’t Tim McVeigh a Christian if he himself said he was? Why is it that other Christians get to decide who’s truly following Christianity, but other Muslims don’t get to do the same? This wreaks of hypocrisy.
3. No one adherent of a religion can be held up as “proof” of that religions teachings, but merely an aspect of what some practitioners of a religion may or may not do/believe. If that wasn’t the case then back to point one, who gets to decide and why? If this point were not true then that mean that anyone claiming a religion is the actual example, so for instance 76% of America claims to be Christian, can any Christian with a straight face claim that Jesus would be proud with our nation…..think hard about that answer…..?
So we come full circle to the original intent of the actual debate which is to be marked out as separate from the madness of the “hell bent” cut and paste crowd. In order to fully examine the context and teachings of what a religion actually is, you have to examine what the texts, scholars, and majority of adherents state about the religion theologically. We don’t categorically assume that Christianity is peaceful for example because some random Christian is or say it is so, we look to the ecclesiastical tradition, the writings of the scholars, and the proclamations, teachings, etc. of the vast majority of Christians regardless of sect. We look for theological consistency.
This is how the “hell bent” crowd are easily dismissed as angry posers who just hate for the sake of hating purely out of ignorance. Everyday, in America people do bad things sometimes violent or not, but essentially go against the message of Christ. Yet, we don’t look at the rapper who praises Jesus at an award show, or the engaged couple who has pre-marital sex, or any litany of fornication’s that occur every second in America, and openly declare these people as heretics or not true Christians do we? No we merely look at them as Christians who are not perfect or who sin. I’m certain that applies to the very “hell bent” posters quite well who probably drink, watch porn, or other non-Christ-like activities.
My point is, if the outsider/non-Christian was just as vain and judgmental as they are, if they used the same “logic” to judge the merits of Christianity as they do with Islam, we would have all kinds of negative things to say about the Christian religion if we looked as this majority Christian nation! But we don’t do that do we? No. We go to the Christian leaders, Scholars, and doctrines.
So, that means that real logic in this debate would mean that we would have to do the same thing with Islam. What is the Islamic doctrine? What do their leaders and scholars teach? What do the majority of Muslims believe?
I already did that in the first post.
The lies of the “hell-bent” crowd is that they honestly believe that by posting how many Muslims committed terror during any period of time that it is indicative of the religion as a whole and the believing body as a whole, but the facts show that, that dog don’t hunt.
They claim matter of factly in this very thread that there have been thousands of terrorists attacks by Muslims since 9/11. Yeah so what?
What does that have to do with Islam?
Point: There are 1.5 billion Muslims in the world, if even 2 million Muslims (doubt it) committed terror in the last 8 years, what were the other billion doing? If 2 million evil Muslims prove that Islam is a violent religion, then what do a billion non-violent Muslims prove about Islam? What do 20k Muslims in the US Military prove about Islam, what about the countless thousands who work, live, and participate throughout every facet of American life? What do our actions say about Islam?
See, this is how you stump hypocrites, because if you return the stone to the glass house, I would have to ask as a non-Christian, what should I think about Christianity when the worlds superpower is 76% Christian, with evangelicals proudly claiming that this nation was founded as a Christian nation, yet the record is replete with non-Christian acts? What should I think about Christianity when in this wealthy nation the least of the people who according to the Bible are the brethren of Jesus, live in poverty without their basic needs being met? Let’s not get into crime, divorce, infant mortality, scandal, adultery, etc. etc. etc. So if the non-Christians wanted to use the same “logic” of the “hell bent” we could easily ask:
Is Christianity a racist religion?
Is Christianity a religion that believes in getting rich at the expense of the poor?
Is Christianity a religion that believes in fornication?
We could do that madness day in and day out, but that would make us no better than the “hell bent” with their neat little sites where they can cut and paste until their heart is content to fuel their hate against others who don’t look like them or believe as they do.
So in the end, the only way they could ever have a leg to stand on in their “proof” that Islam is in fact a violent religion contrary to my assertion in the first post, they would have to prove matter of factly that:
1. Out of 1.5 billion Muslims more than 50% commit acts of violence daily as required by their religion.
2. The majority of Muslim leaders/scholars across the board have issued statements/doctrines that emphatically state that it is the duty of Muslims to commit violence as a tenet of their faith.
3. Since the dawn of Islam the religious writings have been consistent that the point/doctrine of Islam is to promote violence and terrorism.
But we all know they can’t do that, and they know that as well, they just won’t accept it.